Chris, I am late also, and may be touching a subject already existing.
Trying to take a "snapshot" of a web page today is so antiquated. Today
many businesses push/pull information based on who you are...yes whether we
like it or not, our cookies may dictate what we see. I worked for a global
high tech corporation. Everything on the web pages for one group was pulled
from a product data base dependent on the viewer and other issues. So
taking a snapshot of the web page was not relevant. Instead, we had to
analyze the data base which contained product pictures, sales pitches,
warranties, etc... What fed the screen was more important that the visual.
We could not snap the web pages, but we did track the published content.
Carolyn Trim, CRM
-----Original Message-----
From: Records Management Program [mailto:[log in to unmask]]On
Behalf Of Chris Flynn
Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2003 6:31 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Snap shots of Web sites
Sorry I am late to this,
Quite a few Archivists have gone out and either tried or have indeed
scheduled websites as permanent records. So if you are going to apply a
short retention period to your individual websites be sure to check your
governing agencies to ensure you aren't creating a larger problem for
yourself. Next, why are you capturing a website to begin with? I am more
concerned with the system documentation, records generated to the site,
policies and procedures for managing the site, etc.
BTW these records are all permanent as well. For those of you wondering what
I mean permanent; Permanent is forever. If I had a nickel-iridium disk I
would put it on that. If I could provide a mathematical analysis of all of
it I would do that as well. Capturing a dynamic web site as a static record
has some limited value. However, I would ask again, why do it?
Chris Flynn
-----Original Message-----
From: Stephen O'Grady [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 1:24 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Snap shots of Web sites
Just to chime in with an expansion on one of Alan's points, the capture
and storage of dynamically delivered sites is unsurprisingly
exponentially more difficult the more dynamic the site. Tower's web
capture tools are one approach, and there are other products like
Tealeaf that allow the "replay" of dynamically delivered user
experiences, but as far as I'm aware these are not designed with RM in
mind. Some web content management products off the ability to take these
snapshots on an ongoing basis, Interwoven for example stores them as
editions. Again, however, these are rarely designed with RM needs in
mind.
At the risk of sounding too much like an analyst (although I am one :) -
the challenge of capture here depends very heavily on the specific page
components that require storage. If a snapshot of the site as a whole -
replete with navigational elements, etc - is required, Alan's suggested
approach is likely a very workable approach given the limitations of
COTS products.
But if it's rather a couple of constituent elements of the site that
require storage, online manuals and procedures, perhaps, a more basic
solution might be most appropriate. I've worked with an insurance
customer in the past who was able to satisfy their RM requirements by
taking snapshots of a database on an event driven basis - their
requirements deemed navigation and website fluff as not a priority from
a storage perspective. While this was somewhat cumbersome, it was still
far easier than recreating an entire dynamically driven site from
scratch.
>From the sounds of it, given your concerns around formatting, this may
not be applicable, but as a former developer I'm always looking for the
easy way out ;)
Stephen O'Grady
Analyst
RedMonk
(w) 866.RED.MONK
(c) 617.320.9757
-----Original Message-----
From: Alan Pelz-Sharpe [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 3:43 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
I am a technology industry analyst rather than RM expert so my thoughts
on this are very onesided.
The only vendor solution that I am aware of is that of Tower and their
web capture tools.
This particular product seems to do a good job of keeping a 'record'
(contentious word !) of what was on a site on a particular day. One
could keep that image in a Tiff format for example.
The Tiff file would not be an html/shtml/java set of files or whatever
the site consisted of on the day. But there is no other way that I can
think of to produce a record of a dynamic web page.
The issue I guess would be 'how dynamic' some web pages are actually
very static and consist of a few word files or whatever that have been
converted to html. So in theory you would keep the html file as your
record.
But where you have dynamic fields on a website that is a very different
matter.
Hope this helps, rather than confuses.
Alan Pelz-Sharpe
VP Software & Services
Ovum
18 Tremont Street
Suite 1001
Boston, MA 02108
Tel: 617 722 4650
Email: [log in to unmask]
-----Original Message-----
From: Bell, Laura Ms SAALT/IMO [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: 29 May 2003 15:31
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Snap shots of Web sites
I am trying to comment on a records management policy for our Program
management office which addresses procedures for taking "snap shots" of
web sites. The policy is to take snap shots of the web site at the
beginning of the fiscal year, at the midpoint of each fiscal year and
after each significant change to the web site. Snapshots are to be
stored in an electronic system for 2 years after the date taken. the
snap shot will be in the format displayed on the browser of the
receiving computer.
I have with held the name of the electronic system to protect our
information. Just to let you know I do not believe it is in compliance
with DoD 5015.2 Std. My other concerns are as follows:
1) Keeping a snap shot two years may not apply to the disposition of the
subject of the web site. I believe that policy is to keep electronic
records in accordance with subject matter not type of media.
2) I am also concerned about the last sentence. I am not sure that
the
snap shot could be recovered if the format displayed on the browser of
the receiving computer is updated or if the version is changed.
I would appreciate any comments.
Laura F. Bell
FOIA & RM OFFICER
Assistant Secretary Army Acquisition, Logistics and Technology
703-604-7477
[log in to unmask]
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