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Subject:

Re: computerized placement testing

From:

Jessica Nettles <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Open Forum for Learning Assistance Professionals <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Tue, 13 Feb 2007 09:43:50 -0500

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (148 lines)

I see your point and never looked at it like that. I've always thought
that analyzing and writing go together, but now that I look at it from
your angle, I see what you mean. I have students that do really well on
tests, but can't write to save their lives. 

I'm hoping that our school will eventually go to writing samples, but of
course, first they will have to start actually testing our ESL students
with ESL tests. So far, they are tested with the same test as our native
students. We have COMPASS ESL capabilities, but often that is not used. 

I'm not a huge fan either way if no writing samples are given. 

-----Original Message-----
From: Open Forum for Learning Assistance Professionals
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of William W. Ziegler
Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2007 8:35 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: computerized placement testing

Re: point 4 below--
I think a person would have to be a fantastically lucky guesser to post
a high score on COMPASS. But I agree that an editing test is not a good
way to assess a student's production skills. We quickly abandoned the
COMPASS ESL grammar test in favor of a writing sample for ESL writing
placement. Non-native speakers who have studied English abroad are often
terrific at analyzing English grammar, so they can do well on a
multiple-choice test. But, not having had much practice in composing,
they have trouble putting together their own sentences and paragraphs. 

-----Original Message-----
From: Open Forum for Learning Assistance Professionals
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Jessica Nettles
Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 1:37 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: computerized placement testing

1.  What test do you use?

COMPASS

2.  Is it effective in placing students in developmental and college
level mathematics courses?

I'm not so sure since I'm an English and Reading instructor.

3.  Do you administer a Writing Sample in addition to the placement test
in writing skills? 

No, however, we are going to start using e-write in the summer (not soon
enough by my reckoning). 

4.  Is the placement test effective in placing students in developmental
or college level English courses with and/or without a writing sample?

If I was a kid, I'd say "what William said!" His reply to this question
is pretty much on target with what happens with our testing. Often
students that have low writing skills end up testing well enough on the
COMPASS grammar test to be placed in English 098 or higher. This is one
reason I take issue with using the COMPASS without a writing sample.
Some students are particularly adept at guessing answers on multiple
choice tests. I have students in my English 097 and 098 classes who, by
what they scored on the COMPASS, should be able to write in a clear,
understandable way, but barely speak the English language.

Can e-Write help? I hope so. As it stands now, I think COMPASS needs
some work. 

Jess
-----Original Message-----
From: Open Forum for Learning Assistance Professionals
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Margaret Rigney
Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 11:20 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: computerized placement testing

Margaret
 
Margaret Rigney, Director
Library Learning Center/External Funding Connors State College Route 1
Box 1000 Warner, OK 74469-9700
Phone: 918.463.6236
Fax: 918.463.6314
Email: [log in to unmask]
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Open Forum for Learning Assistance Professionals
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Frances Loeffler
Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 9:30 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: computerized placement testing

I am researching computized placement options for a urban communnity
college that is currently using ASSET.  If you are using either COMPASS
or ACCUPLACER, I would appreciate your input on the following:

1.  What test do you use?  COMPASS (WE USED ACCUPLACER PREVIOUSLY & THE
ANSWERS BELOW ARE RELEVANT TO ACCUPLACER AS WELL)

2.  Is it effective in placing students in developmental and college
level mathematics courses? YES

3.  Do you administer a Writing Sample in addition to the placement test

in writing skills? NO

4.  Is the placement test effective in placing students in developmental

or college level English courses with and/ot without a writing sample.
YES

Thank you for your assistance.  I am willing to share the information I
receive, if you are interested. 

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