Print

Print


Hmmm.... you're right... I was doing exactly what I was accusing Ted of... being disdainful and contemptuous of somebody trying to figure out a solution.   I confess there was a "well, how would *you* feel if you were treated that way?" rumbling in my gut... but even if reading Eats, Shoots, and LEaves had me primed for righteous spelling correction, p'raps your angle of correcting is the better one.  (I'm not entirely sure, though.)  

Susan Jones
Academic Development Specialist
Academic Development Center
Parkland College
Champaign, IL  61821
[log in to unmask]
Webmastress,
http://www.resourceroom.net

>>> [log in to unmask] 06/26/06 2:19 PM >>>
Wow! Susan your response to Ted's post was scathing.

I am not Ted's apologist or defender. In fact, I agree with your comments.
This is what I want to suggest:

If we desire to change the erroneous and detrimental perceptions and
attitudes of some instructors and others who are responsible for helping
developmental learners -- we should avoid engaging in fault finding, making
condemning accusations, and asserting euphemistic put-downs. Those
particular actions do not encourage the patience, empathy, compassion,
understanding, tolerance, and faith that is needed to assist and support
developmental learners.

I just wanted to encourage you to offer insight rather that incite.

Enjoy your day and do good work.

On 6/26/06, Susan Jones <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
> <<Why then the low completion rate?  We could spend a whole day
> comtemplating this question ( and perhaps we should) but basically the
> success of each individual student is just that. It depends entirely on
> their personal motivation and not upon our herculean interventions. You
> cannot make a student learn if they do not wish to. You cannot threaten
> them, cajole them, humor them, or go to their houses and turn off their
> tv's. They must want to learn, and then we can help them.>>
>
> That's a wonderful way to feel better and I'd agree if the word "entirely"
> were left out.  In my experience it's more complicated than that.
>
> Helping them is still a pretty major challenge. What is the success rate
> for people who use the services you have available?  And do you see a
> connection between these lower and lower level math courses and student
> motivation?
>
> I work with students who *are* motivated and their success rate is only
> somewhat higher.
>
> <<    And the saga continues two more times. We have added an arithmatic
> course that we euphamistically call prealgebra and believe it or not we have
> added a course before this one called fundamental math. >>
>
> Are you basically trying to say here that  the school is stooping lower
> and lower, but the students aren't reaching up to take the hand - and that
> it simply must be their attitude that makes them so unskilled?
> (Misspelling arithmetic and euphemistically adds a certain irony to the
> paragraph.)
>
> In my experience, one of the most common major frustrations for students -
> and, very possibly, a contributing factor to that lousy success rate -  is
> that the teachers really do find it hard to believe that they don't already
> understand certain basic stuff.  It's more than the daily bruising of the
> ego - the instruction is permeated with incomprehensible gaps.  No matter
> how low you go, if the course is only euphemistically basic, it's not going
> to reach the students, no matter how motivated they are.
>
> I have often pondered why people seem so much more psychologically
> vulnerable when it comes to mathematics.  Perhaps it's partly that constant
> message that "I can't believe I have to *teach* you this," - and usually
> it's not taught, it's simply mentioned, because the teacher doesn't *really*
> believe the student doesn't know it, and so s/he gives it a cursory
> explanation (perhaps dependent on other information the student doesn't
> have) and then quickly moves onward and proceeds as if that explanation had
> been internalized, digested, and applied to previous schema.  So, once
> again, the student gets the message that s/he's an ignorant, uncivilized
> outsider looking in, decides to go watch tv, and the teacher thinks "How
> *did* you get to college? It can't be my job to make up for that... must be
> your attitude..."
>
> Susan Jones
> Academic Development Specialist
> Academic Development Center
> Parkland College
> Champaign, IL  61821
> [log in to unmask] 
> Webmastress,
> http://www.resourceroom.net 
>
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> To access the LRNASST-L archives or User Guide, or to change your
> subscription options (including subscribe/unsubscribe), point your web
> browser to
> http://www.lists.ufl.edu/archives/lrnasst-l.html 
>
> To contact the LRNASST-L owner, email [log in to unmask] 
>

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
To access the LRNASST-L archives or User Guide, or to change your
subscription options (including subscribe/unsubscribe), point your web browser to
http://www.lists.ufl.edu/archives/lrnasst-l.html 

To contact the LRNASST-L owner, email [log in to unmask]

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
To access the LRNASST-L archives or User Guide, or to change your
subscription options (including subscribe/unsubscribe), point your web browser to
http://www.lists.ufl.edu/archives/lrnasst-l.html

To contact the LRNASST-L owner, email [log in to unmask]