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Interesting discussion.  I have a few questions for us to consider as 
we discuss this issue.

1)	If grades are not a motivating factor or can not be used for 
developmental courses, why are they used for non-developmental courses? 
  Do they motivate students there?
2)	Why do we use grades in any course?  What is their purpose?  Is that 
purpose met only in non-developmental courses?
3)	What is unique about non-developmental courses that allows for 
grading to be used there but not in developmental courses?  Is it the 
students, the money, or the institution?
4)	What is the purpose of a GPA system?  Is it to reflect, in some 
manner, the level of knowledge which a student has acquired?  Is it to 
reflect their level of performance in their course work?  Are there 
other reasons and do those reasons or purposes only apply to 
non-developmental students?
5)	If a student is accepted at a post secondary school and subsequently 
required to take developmental course work, doesn't the institution 
have some responsibility to the student? Are there equity and fair 
treatment issues here?
6)	 Is there a reason why the developmental student is not treated in 
the same manner re gpa as his or her non-developmental counterparts at 
that institution?  Is that reason quantifiable?  Can that reason be 
supported by valid research?  Is there a reason to discriminate against 
these students which has valid pedagogical or andrygogical support?

Considering these issues makes one consider their own philosophy of 
education?  Are students really educatable?  Can we really teach 
anything to students?  Do we open doors or guard them from entry?

Ron

Ronald D. Illingworth
Professor
Interior-Aleutians Campus
University of Alaska Fairbanks
907-474-5890 (w)
907-474-5561 (fax)
http://www.iac.uaf.edu/
http://www.faculty.uaf.edu/ffrdi/

On Nov 8, 2006, at 7:33 AM, Karyn Schulz wrote:

> Hello friends
>
> I've been reading this string and have been wondering how developmental
> courses can be counted in a GPA if they are not credit worthy. I also
> thought that some states do not allow for these courses to be included
> in the GPA because of their non-credit status. While the concept of
> motivation is important, the grade should not be the only factor
> involved.
>
> Karyn Schulz
> University of Baltimore
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Open Forum for Learning Assistance Professionals
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Alan Craig
> Sent: Wednesday, November 08, 2006 10:32 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: How grades are counted for remedial courses
>
> Melissa,
>
> At Georgia Perimeter College (a multi-campus, two-year unit of the
> University System of Georgia with about 20,000 students), grades earned
> in
> our Learning Support courses (what developmental education is called in
> Georgia) are not counted in the GPA. The courses do not count for 
> degree
> credit. They do count for institutional credit, e.g., financial aid.
>
> This system has been in place for quite some time. I could only
> speculate on
> the motivational impact; I think others have described the
> possibilities.
>
> Is the overall impact on GPA positive for these courses at your school?
>
> A final thought: It seems inconsistent, perhaps unfair, to not count a
> course for degree credit but to count that course in the cumulative GPA
> for
> the degree.
>
>
> Thanks!
>
> Alan Craig
>
> Coordinator-Dunwoody Learning & Tutoring Center
> Georgia Perimeter College
> 2101 Womack Road
> Dunwoody, GA 30338
> 770-274-5242
> [log in to unmask]
>
> The union of the mathematician with the poet, fervor with measure,
> passion
> with correctness, this surely is the ideal.
> --William James
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Open Forum for Learning Assistance Professionals
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Melissa Chandler
> Sent: Tuesday, November 07, 2006 10:16 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: How grades are counted for remedial courses
>
> The administration is wanting to change the way grades in remedial
> courses
> count at my institution. Currently the remedial courses don't count
> toward
> graduation, but the grades figure into the student's GPA. They are
> wanting
> to change that policy so the grades for remedial courses won't figure
> into
> the GPA. The remedial grades will still count for Financial aid and
> athletic
> eligibility, but that is all. My concern is student motivation if their
> grade doesn't matter.
> They will still be required to take the courses if they score into 
> them,
> and
> they will need a certain grade to pass, but will that be enough
> motivation.
> Motivation is a problem to begin with in this area.
> What do other institutions do with grades? How does this affect
> motivation?
> We are a small two-year community college.
> Thanks for your response.
> Melissa Chandler
>
> Melissa Chandler
> Developmental Specialist
> Allen County Community College
> 1801 North Cottonwood
> Iola, KS 66749
> (620) 365-5116 ext. 247
> [log in to unmask]
>
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