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the term "shining minority" had nothing to do with racial terms.
Minority was used as a minority of people in that circumstance and
had nothing to do with race. Minority means not majority.When I said
shining minority, I meant that woman was one of the  LESS THAN 50%
THAT APPRECIATED WHAT SHE GOT AND SUCCEEDED! What happened to our
English language when we use words with their true dictionary meaning
and people take them to have some social meaning.I hope this cleas
this up.

Also welfare reform should include whatever it takes to get people
off welfare and into careers and YES, IT SHOULD INCLUDE COLLEGE FOR
THISE WHO WISH. I have no problem with that at all as long as the
person works hard and appreciates what they get. I had many students
who had welfare pay for school and said they were only their because
it was free and refused to do their class work and homework. That is
what I do not like.

Minority means less than 50%.I hope this clears up any
misunderstanding. Sometimes I hate English, as there are too many
words that have the same meaning. Now I know why I prefer Italian. It
is  so much easier.

Prof L

> For fear that my commentary may enrage my fellow
> listservers, here are my two cents comments.  It is not
> often that I respond but believing it necessary and
> appropriate here goes:
>
> Susan Andrien's comments were right on.  I  must, however,
> respond to
> Prof L.
>
> It appears that there is a perception that there are a "sea
> of abusers" who are waiting in line to defraud the
> government for an opportunity to attend college.  In lieu of
> welfare reform, I do not believe such is the case.  As a
> matter of fact, the trend is for these recipients to return
> to the workforce and forego education.
>
> About a year ago I worked at a community college in Kankakee
> as the Director of Adult Education.  We held monthly
> commuity meetings in which a representative from various
> agencies would gather to update each other on new policies,
> procedures and programmatic concerns.
>
> I distinctly remember a gentlemen from the  Illinois
> Department of Public Aid who attended regularily.  The
> comment that he made regularily at these meetings that has
> stuck with me was, "the cases of public aid abuse of
> benefits is overstated by the general public.  Sure it
> exists, but not in the numbers that we believe."  This is
> not to negate the fact that you may have encounted students
> in your classes who use the system.
>
> When minorities make it off the welfare rolls, we become a
> "shining minority."  Does this mean that those who stay on
> are a " tarnished minority."  Let us not discount the fact
> that higher education has not always been so receptive to
> the underprivledged.
>
> Not only do we not understand poverty, its implications in
> higher education and effects in the classroom, but we have
> become the judge, jury and prosecutor.  Yes I have seen the
> motivated to learn come through the doors of higher ed, only
> to retreat because of educator's perceptions of them.
>
> I see myself as a voice for the voiceless on this campus.
>
> Vada E. Southern, Ed.D.
> Assistant to the Dean for Recruitment & Retention
> Northern Illinois University
> DeKalb, IL
>
>
> At 07:02 PM 1/22/98 -0500, you wrote:
> >I would have thought that NOTHING could get me to stop
> checking placement
> >scores for evening classes during the first week of school
> until I read Carla
> >Chapman's remarks.  I am a Dean at a community college.  I
> went through college
> >in Massachusetts on Welfare, a single mother of two
> children.  Thanks to the
> >Commonwealth of Massachusetts, I am not a drug dealer or an
> overage hooker,
> >but a working professional who pays more in taxes each year
> than I received in
> >aid for the entire four years I was on Welfare back in the
> 70s.
> >
> >Of the many astonishing claims that Ms. Chapman and others
> have made, I'll
> >concentrate on two:
> >"There is nothing more frustrating" than having students in
> your class who are
> >only in it for the money???  Let's think a minute.  Surely
> there are SOME
> >things more frustrating than this experience (which I have
> had, by the way):
> >for example, what about the frustration of being a student
> in a course where
> >the teacher despises you and feels you are incapable of
> learning??  What about
> >being accepted into a classroom in which you are invisible?
> >
> >The second statement that offended and shocked me is that a
> motivated student
> >will find a way to learn even without government programs.
> I'd like to wave my
> >magic wand and have every person who's ever uttered this
> phrase do it herself.
> >Did you ever face a situation where you could only get jobs
> that paid less than
> >you needed to live?  I did and, although I am an able and
> resourceful person, I
> >could not manage college without help.  What we all need to
> acknowledge is
> >that programs like the one that got me through college no
> longer exist.
> >Welfare recipients now get job training, not education.  If
> that.
> >
> >Brothers and sisters, let's not become jerks just because
> higher education is
> >not shaped to change the world.  Higher ed is mostly
> designed to replicate the
> >class system that already exists.  But now this tool is
> ours--If we reshape it,
> > we CAN help to change the world.  Students who walk into
> any classroom may
> >have problems and deficiencies
> >of various kinds, but nearly all of them also have at least
> a small glimmer of
> >hope--the hope that this
> >time, the teacher will see the value they bring with their
> person to this
> >classroom.  I'll just quote Mina Shaughnessey here: "always
> assume that there
> >is a silent student in the back of the romm greater of head
> and of heart than
> >you."
> >                                        Susan Andrien
> >
> But you are a success story because you did not abuse the
> system and
> you were motivated to learn. YOu wanted to learn and you
> did. You
> were only on welfare for 4 years and you are an inspiration
> to us
> all. However others are on it for careers and are not
> motivated
> shining starts like yourself. You are a shining minority.
> There are a
> sea of abusers out there that need to be in check.
>
> Congratulations on a job well done
>
> Prof L
>
Sue Lorraine Lavorata
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